I was a little kid when the original skits aired, but I always thought the "Men on..." skits were hilarious. So I looked some up today and they were still funny, but I guess straight men making fun of gays hasn't exactly aged well.
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 90 | October 1, 2021 10:03 AM |
So frustrating, we just had a thread on this a couple weeks ago, and it's gone.
| by Anonymous | reply 2 | September 28, 2021 6:25 PM |
I have the link to the thread we just had on Men On Film in my history but the page comes up blank.
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 3 | September 28, 2021 6:26 PM |
We give it two snaps up in a circle!
| by Anonymous | reply 4 | September 28, 2021 6:29 PM |
Oh, thanks, R3! I see responses when I follow the link. Sorry for basically re-posting a similar question a month later...
| by Anonymous | reply 5 | September 28, 2021 6:31 PM |
I give it two snaps up, a kiss, and a twist!
| by Anonymous | reply 6 | September 28, 2021 6:35 PM |
This is Corey Booker when he's away from the cameras.
| by Anonymous | reply 7 | September 28, 2021 6:41 PM |
Embarrassingly derogatory and funny as hell at the same time
| by Anonymous | reply 8 | September 28, 2021 6:41 PM |
These were among some of my favorite skits growing up. My favorite was men on film.
| by Anonymous | reply 10 | September 28, 2021 7:01 PM |
Loved it at the time. Don’t know if I’d feel the same way. Somehow I give David a pass but not Damon.
| by Anonymous | reply 11 | September 28, 2021 7:02 PM |
I hated it at the time but now love it. The less than 100% societal homophobia makes it easier to laugh at oneself.
| by Anonymous | reply 13 | September 28, 2021 10:24 PM |
I love it. I always took it to be more of an inside joke then as an insult.
| by Anonymous | reply 14 | September 28, 2021 10:58 PM |
OP is a professional victim.
| by Anonymous | reply 15 | September 28, 2021 11:01 PM |
Is David Alan Grier really straight? He always has read to me as gay.
| by Anonymous | reply 17 | September 28, 2021 11:30 PM |
It's like an evening at the Datalounge.
| by Anonymous | reply 18 | September 28, 2021 11:32 PM |
I loved Damon's outfits. Hysterical.
| by Anonymous | reply 19 | September 28, 2021 11:44 PM |
some gay guy - maybe closeted - was a writer. because "men on ...." was hitting gay culture in real time.
| by Anonymous | reply 21 | September 28, 2021 11:58 PM |
It was a product of its time and it was funny. But we certainly don’t need anything similar now.
| by Anonymous | reply 22 | September 29, 2021 12:01 AM |
I loved the way David would pronounce some words, like "bowl", bo-uhl.
| by Anonymous | reply 23 | September 29, 2021 12:01 AM |
Always found it a lil suss and kind of interesting that the pro-wrestling tag team of Miz & John Morrison closely based some of their pre-taped skits (titled ‘The Dirt Sheet’) on the ‘Men On...’ format. Like even the backdrop was the same....
Didn’t help that their characters were sometimes made fun of for being ‘too close’ (I.e. gay for each other) in some ways, and that rather than the usual trash-talking they used to brag about being gorgeous and stylish and culturally-superior as well as make bitchy remarks about rivals (it’s so painfully DL).
Hard to believe that it blew the mind of the wrestling community at the time (early-mid 2000s, iirc). Before that, there had been dozens of effeminate-looking and acting wrestlers, but in terms of actual scripted content the catty genre-savvy material like that just hadn’t been done.
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 24 | September 29, 2021 12:03 AM |
I give it 2 snaps up, in a Z formation.
| by Anonymous | reply 25 | September 29, 2021 12:10 AM |
"but I guess straight men making fun of gays hasn't exactly aged well."
Are we sure about that statement. I was NEVER convinced that either one of those guys was straight.
| by Anonymous | reply 26 | September 29, 2021 12:17 AM |
Minutes 3:03 - 3:28 of this clip must've been written by a DataLounger...
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 27 | September 29, 2021 12:21 AM |
“Scrump tious I’m through.”
Love that vid at r20.
| by Anonymous | reply 28 | September 29, 2021 12:32 AM |
Just know that NO WHITE person would ever get away with this gay minstrelsy!
| by Anonymous | reply 29 | September 29, 2021 12:36 AM |
I felt vindicated to learn (in "Homey Don't Play That," the book on In Living Color's production) that the character types came out of Keenan and Damon Wayans' childhood role playing. The "Men On ..." sketches were the first time I felt seen on TV. Even at that early of an age, I was like, "That's me and my brother."
| by Anonymous | reply 30 | September 29, 2021 12:42 AM |
I’m with you R26. They ping from earth to the outer edge of the universe, and back. Hilarious, and the material holds up well..
| by Anonymous | reply 31 | September 29, 2021 12:43 AM |
Gay minstrel show so straight people could laugh at us.
So, of course, some of you liked it.
| by Anonymous | reply 32 | September 29, 2021 12:53 AM |
This show was so much funnier than SNL (so was MadTV). And yet SNL is the one that still drags along.
| by Anonymous | reply 33 | September 29, 2021 12:55 AM |
[quote] Gay minstrel show so straight people could laugh at us.
I knew some humorless Mary like you would show up. The skits were funny as hell.
| by Anonymous | reply 35 | September 29, 2021 12:57 AM |
When this was airing GLAAD was sending out statements of outrage.
Meanwhile you could go to any gay video bar and the crowd would be in hysterics watching these clips.
"Clutch the pearls, what a sneaky thing to do!"
Also loved "Men on Sports," where we learned that their favorite football player was Bob Griese.
| by Anonymous | reply 36 | September 29, 2021 1:02 AM |
I grew up in the 80s/early 90s and watched In Living Colour religiously. It was such an innovative and funny show, truly nothing was out like it at the time. Men on Film (along with Della Reese's Pieces and pretty much everything Kim Wayans and Jim Carrey did) was one of my faves. As a young, naive gayling, I don't remember what I was thinking other than finding those two flaming guys funny. But I did learn the Z-snap from them, so there was a degree of reverence whenever I imitated them or saw someone else do the same thing. So, when I look back on the skits today, as "hateful" one might read into the material, I think there was also some sense of empowerment. Damon Wayans and Grier leaned a little too far into the stereotype at times, but there is simultaneously the sense that these two characters couldn't give a fuck about how effeminate they were and the fact that they both enjoy gay sex. When you listen to the audience reaction, I get a sense there is a mixture of adoration and abjection.
Had I been in my 30s or older at the time, I'm not sure how I would have felt about it. But, it's clear that the series was pushing boundaries where few were at the time (Kids in the Hall comes immediately to mind). People like to talk about how the African-American community has a longer way to go with gay acceptance than the rest of the country, yet, sometimes, it's the African-American community that is more progressive than the rest of us. Even today, Lil Nas X is edgier than his white gay peers.
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 37 | September 29, 2021 1:03 AM |
I never watched this. Was this where the “we’re gonna pump you up!” Catch phrase came from?
| by Anonymous | reply 38 | September 29, 2021 1:07 AM |
Pump you up came from the Dana Carvey and Kevin Nealon skits on SNL: Pumping Up with Hans & Franz.
| by Anonymous | reply 39 | September 29, 2021 1:16 AM |
R32 - “ Gay minstrel show so straight people could laugh at us. So, of course, some of you liked it.”
We’re laughing at the flaming queen stereotype, which is NOT the majority of gay men. The educated straights, especially those with gay children and friends already know this.
It’s the straight, uninformed bigots of the world who will generalize that all gay men act like these two guys.
| by Anonymous | reply 40 | September 29, 2021 1:41 AM |
[quote]People like to talk about how the African-American community has a longer way to go with gay acceptance than the rest of the country, yet, sometimes, it's the African-American community that is more progressive than the rest of us. Even today, Lil Nas X is edgier than his white gay peers.
And Big Freedia as well. I like them both.
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 41 | September 29, 2021 1:44 AM |
[quote] Meanwhile you could go to any gay video bar and the crowd would be in hysterics watching these clips
THANK YOU!! I was late twenties and hanging out in a huge gay club in Houston (JR’s) and when one of these skits came on, the entire club came to a standstill for three minutes.
Regular gay guys LOVED these skits, because you may not have been like these two, but you KNEW someone who was, and there were obviously gays on the writing staff, because much of that stuff was completely on1the-nose about gay culture.
[quote] when I look back on the skits today, as "hateful" one might read into the material, I think there was also some sense of empowerment. Damon Wayans and Grier leaned a little too far into the stereotype at times, but there is simultaneously the sense that these two characters couldn't give a fuck about how effeminate they were and the fact that they both enjoy gay sex
Nothing hateful at all. As silly as they were, there were two men who knew who they were and accepted themselves. They were completely and utterly ‘empowered!’ Self-knowledge and self-acceptance made them untouchable by bigotry.
Besides, it’s a comedy routine, not a documentary.
| by Anonymous | reply 42 | September 29, 2021 2:08 AM |
[quote]Nothing hateful at all. As silly as they were, there were two men who knew who they were and accepted themselves. They were completely and utterly ‘empowered!’ Self-knowledge and self-acceptance made them untouchable by bigotry. Besides, it’s a comedy routine,
Well said.
| by Anonymous | reply 43 | September 29, 2021 2:19 AM |
It was as much about the wit as it was the flaming stereotype. Of course, they can go hand-in-hand much like Buddy Cole.
| by Anonymous | reply 44 | September 29, 2021 2:22 AM |
The movie Grease was ruined by Olivia Newton Fish John.
| by Anonymous | reply 45 | September 29, 2021 2:24 AM |
They were hysterical. Couldn’t do these today.
| by Anonymous | reply 46 | September 29, 2021 2:28 AM |
Could they be the origin of the sassy and fierce gay stereotype of white men acting like sassy black women?
I believe comedy is what the individual audience member, or viewer, makes of it.
| by Anonymous | reply 47 | September 29, 2021 2:34 AM |
[quote]Could they be the origin of the sassy and fierce gay stereotype of white men acting like sassy black women?
NO. Gay men were being sassy and fierce decades before that!
| by Anonymous | reply 49 | September 29, 2021 2:46 AM |
I think they’re hilarious. I love that show especially Ugly Wanda
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 50 | September 29, 2021 2:55 AM |
I loved the Men On skits. Of course they were ridiculous but as a kid I also felt the characters were kind of cool.
| by Anonymous | reply 51 | September 29, 2021 3:26 AM |
[Quote] So frustrating, we just had a thread on this a couple weeks ago, and it's gone.
R2 How dreadful. You should save all the threads and file them yourself. Keep them on your hard drive. You can then have them at your finger tips whenever you need them.
I agree we shouldn't lose these threads. And they must be organized properly in proper storage for future retrieval and use.
| by Anonymous | reply 53 | September 29, 2021 3:41 AM |
There was a "Men On" where Blaine gets hit by an overhead light and turns into a gruff, butch straight guy, much to Toine's horror.
I forgot how they resolved turning him gay again but the audience cheered. They wanted Blaine back and Toine to be happy.
| by Anonymous | reply 54 | September 29, 2021 5:25 AM |
In Living Color has aged horribly like Jim Carrey. It has never stayed relevant past its horrible 90s set up. Some of the later seasons with Jamie Foxx were good though.
| by Anonymous | reply 55 | September 29, 2021 5:33 AM |
R25 I was just coming here to post that! My friend used to say that all the time back in ‘91.
| by Anonymous | reply 56 | September 29, 2021 5:34 AM |
so funny. i love in living color. so risky and funny and full of talented people. too bad it would never get made today.
| by Anonymous | reply 57 | September 29, 2021 5:37 AM |
As a child watching with my mother, they were probably the first gay characters I had ever seen.
| by Anonymous | reply 58 | September 29, 2021 5:57 AM |
@r32, Lighten up, if it were up to you all comedy would stop in fear of offending someone. Comedy is a fine line between what's funny and what's mean and oppressive. These guys did a pretty good job of straddling that line. Also, being two black men there's a subliminal bond knowing they too have been the brunt of mean and oppressive jokes
| by Anonymous | reply 59 | September 29, 2021 10:03 AM |
Dang, Wanda was built like a linebacker
| by Anonymous | reply 60 | September 29, 2021 12:26 PM |
As a gay man, I fucking LOVE those skits. They're brilliant.
| by Anonymous | reply 61 | September 29, 2021 12:35 PM |
[quote] I always took it to be more of an inside joke then as an insult.
David Alan Grier said in an interview they quit doing the skits because at some point they grew uneasy with the way many in the audience were receiving them. In other words--too many people were laughing AT the queens, not appreciating the queens and laughing WITH them.
[quote] I was NEVER convinced that either one of those guys was straight.
FWIW, David Alan Grier has been married a couple of times to women and has at least one kid. Damon Wayans was married for a really long time and has a bunch of kids.
| by Anonymous | reply 62 | September 29, 2021 2:00 PM |
These were absolutely horrible and worthy of derision.
But, I loved them. I am still fond of them.
| by Anonymous | reply 63 | September 29, 2021 2:05 PM |
[quote]Nothing hateful at all
R42, I did place "hateful" in quotation marks, as in it is open to interpretation. Nothing you wrote was in actual disagreement with what you quoted from me.
I also alluded to the audience reaction in the clip I posted being a mixture of adoration and abjection. As R62 just mentioned, the skits were discontinued because it was believed that the audience wasn't fully in on the joke and--in part--laughing at the characters.
Sure, it was a comedy routine, not a "documentary." But the routines themselves documented revelatory aspects about the times we were living in back then. It's actually possible to discuss that whilst appreciating the skits themselves.
| by Anonymous | reply 64 | September 29, 2021 2:09 PM |
The earlier the skits, the funnier they were. After a while, it just became dick and butt fucking jokes. But, the skits that were good were very good.
| by Anonymous | reply 65 | September 29, 2021 2:09 PM |
I can’t remember where I saw an interview with David where he said that the primary writer for the skits was a gay man so he felt comfortable with material.
| by Anonymous | reply 66 | September 29, 2021 2:15 PM |
Well like any other depiction of a marginalized group that leans heavily on stereotypes, they were regressive in some ways but forward thinking in others. I mentioned this is the other thread--my favorite was the 2-parter where Blaine suffers a head injury and suddenly becomes macho straight. It's linked at OP in the thread at R3. "Straight Blaine" is boring, obnoxious, and homophobic, and in desperation Antione bashes him over the head to bring the real Blaine back. And he does come roaring back--with the audience going crazy at the reveal. Pretty daring to get the audience to hate straight Blaine and cheer for the return of sissy gay Blaine. Basically they got the audience to support a gay man being his authentic self, even if that was a very stereotypical caricature version of a self.
And it was clearly not mean spirited, although good intention don't excuse everything. As over the top the characters were they were fun and very likable with killer snarkability.
| by Anonymous | reply 67 | September 29, 2021 2:16 PM |
I remember groups of Gays in clubs would simultaneously do "Three snaps up with a Z twist" to show approval for anything
| by Anonymous | reply 68 | September 29, 2021 2:24 PM |
I think Jim Carey's Obviously Gay Man character was much more anti-gay than the Men On... sketches.
| by Anonymous | reply 69 | September 29, 2021 2:24 PM |
How about this? Offensive?
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 70 | September 29, 2021 2:38 PM |
One difference between Men on Film and Lyle (Dana Carvey) is that there is a camaraderie between Antoine and Blaine as well as an empowerment that is missing with the SNL bit, making it more uncomfortable. That isn't to say there aren't satirical elements that at least partially work. For instance, it's pointing out the ridiculousness of an effeminate man who is gay still trying to lead a heterosexual life in the 1980s. But it glosses over men in flyover country who would do it out of self-preservation in a society that was still very unwelcoming to people like them.
The Lyle sketch is much more awkwardly executed especially if you consider the "frat boy" vibe of SNL at the time. But, I still find it funny largely due to vocal intonations of Carvey (who I think was one of SNL's "greats").
Around that same time or maybe a few years later, SNL did "Schmidt's Gay," which was hilarious. You were kind of laughing at Adam Sandler and Chris Farley and the models, but, the fact of the matter was their characters were unapologetic for how much they loved really hot dick, more in line with Antoine and Blaine. Certainly, some of the audience would find it "disgusting", but it didn't really matter as the characters don't care what the audience thinks.
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 71 | September 29, 2021 3:08 PM |
I can laugh at myself and this.
| by Anonymous | reply 73 | September 29, 2021 5:10 PM |
R71 that sketch is clever, inoffensive and works well because of the subverted audience expectation—it’s a beer commercial with two frat boys, so of course we anticipate that hot half-naked *female* swimsuit models will appear to populate their pool party fantasy. The surprise gender-flipped trope is the joke, rather than laughing at the fact that these are two young bros who love cock.
| by Anonymous | reply 74 | September 29, 2021 5:22 PM |
R71 Put it great. The joke of a super gay man trying to be straight is mocking the gay. “haha look at this gay guy trying to be something he isn’t. How pathetic”.
In Men on Film they are proud to be gay and proud to be feminine.
| by Anonymous | reply 75 | September 29, 2021 5:37 PM |
I watched some recently I laughed my ass off. I’m easy to amuse.
| by Anonymous | reply 76 | September 29, 2021 5:58 PM |
But Miss Grier is a black Tony winner!
She MUST be sacrosanct!
| by Anonymous | reply 77 | September 29, 2021 6:02 PM |
I never found the skit to be very funny.
| by Anonymous | reply 78 | September 29, 2021 6:05 PM |
Stereotypes can be very funny because there is a lot of truth to them.
| by Anonymous | reply 79 | September 29, 2021 6:15 PM |
It's all funny. And prisspot wokeness does not apply retroactively.
| by Anonymous | reply 80 | September 29, 2021 6:16 PM |
30 yrs later, I still STEAL that material from In Living Color. Along with Miss Jenkins
| by Anonymous | reply 81 | September 29, 2021 6:33 PM |
David's character seems 1 part Little Richard + 1 part Church Lady.
| by Anonymous | reply 82 | September 29, 2021 6:54 PM |
R71 I think the Schmitt's Gay ad was great. It was an excellent send up of that frat boy homoerotic while also homophobic culture and did not at all punch down on gays. Surprising that it came out of that very frat boy atmosphere of early 90s SNL.
| by Anonymous | reply 83 | September 29, 2021 8:11 PM |
"I watched some recently I laughed my ass off. I’m easy to amuse. "
After two cocktails I'll laugh at anything
| by Anonymous | reply 84 | September 29, 2021 8:59 PM |
[quote] Just know that NO WHITE person would ever get away with this gay minstrelsy!
Offsite Link| by Anonymous | reply 85 | September 29, 2021 9:17 PM |
Add me to the list of people who love the Schmidt's Gay sketch. I saw when it first aired and was so pleasantly surprised to see something that wasn't anti-gay, homophobic or making fun of gay men.
| by Anonymous | reply 87 | September 30, 2021 4:31 PM |
[quote]David Alan Grier said in an interview they quit doing the skits because at some point they grew uneasy with the way many in the audience were receiving them. In other words--too many people were laughing AT the queens, not appreciating the queens and laughing WITH them.
There you go. That kind of edgy humor that was popular two or three decades ago depended on the assumption that at least the main part of your audience got the joke and was cool about it. You can't make that assumption anymore.
| by Anonymous | reply 88 | September 30, 2021 4:41 PM |
That’s why Dave Chappelle walked away from his show. Folks failed to appreciate the subversive undertones of his comedy, but on the stereotypes instead.
| by Anonymous | reply 89 | September 30, 2021 5:21 PM |
The "Hated it!" catchphrase is very funny, as is the euphemistic "from a male perspective". But the rest of the material in those clips I found extremely lame; tiresome innuendo that can't hold a candle to the 25 years older "Julian and Sandy" (who also had the advantage of being performed by actual gay men).
| by Anonymous | reply 90 | October 1, 2021 10:03 AM |
